‘Richard’ is obsessed on the AIT/OIT question. I think that if you look at the short history of India in WHEE you will in fact see the simplicity of the overall structure. The question of India in the Axial Age is vital to understanding, yet never discussed, and Buddhism is filtered out of the discussion, usually, when the subject is Hinduism.
I think that ‘Hinduism’ (mostly a modern/western invention really) is wrapper than can be unwrapped to leave Indian religion visible for the first time.
I can help it if the Aryan myth in India has gone on so long, and yet is false. My history of India is actually a breath of fresh air in that regard.
Christianity, the Deadliest Poison & Zen, the Antidote to All Poisons [Hardcover]
I have often noted at Darwiniana.com that the New Atheist movement is a confusing echo of Rajneesh’s critique of Christianity.
We had some discussions of Christopher Calder on Rajneesh, but his web pages seem to have disappeared.
update: If you google calder you will find his pages cached in various places.
Calder was different from many critics: he actually seemed to like Rajneesh, or was ambivalent, but didnt really understand who he was dealing with.
update 2: this article was linked here for a long time, but its points hadn’t quite sunk in since I hadn’t fully digested, or read it. Since I was not so susceptible to anti-Rajneesh propaganda it didn’t seem to matter to me. But reading this article sets the record straight on so many points that I think it should be better know. Calder’s articles as referred to here were not fully known to me, and I found some of his original articles of interest. But I wasn’t aware of the gross distortions that are here exposed, along with the issues of Milne and his book, the nitrous oxide confusions, and the rest of it.
It is easy to be thrown off track here: I was originally open to the suggestion of thalium poisoning, but then was thrown off by the disinformation refutations.
Now it seems we are back there to what seemed obvious at the time, that Rajneesh’s health went down hill right after he left Rajneeshpuram.
A little more awareness of the undercover fascism of the CIA should make it less weird to claim Rajneesh might have been poisoned.
They almosts certainly murdered JFK!
A lot of charges against Rajneesh are junk. As the writer here notes, it was Rajneesh who denounced Sheela, as I remember very well.
christopher calder rajneesh
Here is some response to Calder, which I am putting here for safe keeping:
CHRISTOPHER CALDER, KRISHNA CHRIST AND HIS LYING OR MISINFORMED “LOST TRUTH”.
A response to Mr. Calder´s “Osho, Bhagwan Rajneesh and the Lost Truth” By Anthony Thompson Ph. D.
*English is not my first language, so forgive my misspellings and grammatical mistakes.
Read the rest of this entry »
Full disclosure (amounting to not much):
I said I have had no contact with the Rajneessh orgs: not quite true. First I was one of the first to start reading Rajneesh in 1975 (in the general public in USA), met and lived briefly with one of his sannyasins in New York (who pressured me to join, in vain). I often visited the various centers in their public aspects, and saw sannyasins in New York, on the East Side (in their flowing robes). But I was always on the outside. Then in the eighties I lived in the Ashram in Oregon for three weeks in their homeless persons program.
A spectacular moment when outsiders could gain access to the Oregan chaos. I had heard of this new program in Colorado and took a set of freighttrains to the Oregon spot (no mean feat). To get to the nearest town you had to ride a train from Klamath Falls to Washington State, and get a train back that would stop in the little town near Rajneeshpuram in Oregon. I will always remember the miraculous moment when the freight train stopped in that town, unpexpectedly. From there I walked the twenty/thirty miles to the ashram, where they admitted me. I stayed a few weeks, but couldn’t last, the homeless program being suddenly marginalized, a pity, since a month later Rajneesh started speaking again and produced his classic ‘Rajneesh Bible’ series. Then everything blew up and that was the end of it. The whole experience was downright spooky.
Watching that freighttrain stopped so unexpectedly was an instant shearing of reality. The hobos on the train were dumbfounded, and I walked with some hobo wine jugs to the New City across the Oregan wilds in about a day and a half, guzzling down the hobo wine, trying to figure out how the ‘guru field’ could alter freight train movements. The world seemed suddenly like a cartoon. That experience of the ‘guru’, something that was beyond the figure Rajneesh, yet triggered by his presence several hundred miles away (update: more like forty or so miles) was an eyeopener, to say the least. It had nothing to do with him.
I say that, because if you get ‘too close’, sometimes, you end up very far away again.
That was a real ‘darshan experience, just trying to approach that guru prescence, and walking two days in the Oregon wilds. It was over before I got there, and my visit to Rajneeshtown was almost beside the point after that. Actually getting to Rajneeshpuram was almost a let down (I was so anti-social I couldn;t handle the place) and I realized I had already ‘done it’. One thing was clear, darshan is real, but not in the way you expect.
But observing the place was an important experience. A warning to get the facts, if that is possible.
I never saw an infrastructure as they had put up in Oregon. That it was betrayed is obvious, I guess, but as with everything Osho did, the beginning was a stupendous effort, then everything collapsed.
I was totally lucky to get in briefly still as an outsider.
The critics of that ashram don’t really know what happened there, before the crooks spoiled it. A fully functioning city, with all its parts and pieces at a high level of function. And an awful lot of CIA agents, FBI and other saboteurs.
I never understood why Rajneesh put someone like Sheila in charge, when the general tone of the sannyasins there was the highest level of integrity and massive effort to create a complete society with all its infrastructure. It is amazing what they were able to accomplish.
Small wonder the CIA et al. were absolutely terrified. The experiment was genuinely revolutionary, until it derailed. The powers that be had to destroy it asap. That leaves me suspcious of all accounts. I do not exhonerate anyone here, not Rajneesh’s group, and certainly not the army of hidden goverhment agents out to destroy it.
It is hard to get to the bottom of what happened, and I was there!
But from its ideal aspect, as I noted, it was a genuine and cleverly disguised revolution: if a group of people could produce a social structure at that level of cooperation and justice in a mere three years, the status quo was in deep trouble. The whole thing, like any revolution I guess, suddenly went off its rails;
Then a few years later when Rajneesh died I thought it sad he had died so soon, and applied for sannyas via mail order and was duly sent a mala and name.
With this I attended a large something/what? in upstate New York at the famous New Age center there. I bombed on the first day and disappeared in the woods losing my hard earned money shelled out for the various group dingdangs. I coulnt’ handle being a member and panicked. Further, an Indian sannyasin there told me my sannyas name got by mail order was a Sanskrit mistake and had a double entendre in Hindi and said I shouldn’t use it, which made some of the org people furious. i was so put out by that I invented my own sannyasin name and took off on my own. The name I gave mysefl was Swami Anand Purusha, but none of the sannyasins would acknowledge it. So on I got the message I was in the wrong place and skulked off in disgust/disarray. But that was me: the tone and vigor of the Rajnessh movement was something elemental, whatever the case with what is left.
That’s why I am wary of the vicious and hysterical anger of many of his critics. It is a strange phenomenon, all around.
That’s the grand total of my Rajneesh interactions, a sorry tale. But it has made me observe it from, well, not a distance, but relatively close up.
What I saw doesn’t really correspond to the desperate and hysterical denunciations from some quarters.
I went in search of Sarlo’s guru rating service, and instead found a host of critics:
The Truth About Sarlo’s Guru Ratings Service
Sarlo’s list always struck me as problematical, but the critics are no more objective. I read this blog above with interest, until the tide of obvious slanders in reverse got to be too much.
This is an example:
One thing should be absolutely clear to the aware reader by now: Sarlo’s Guru Rating Service has an unstated and hidden agenda to subvert public and sannyas perceptions about the mafia-like war that has been waged inside Osho’s movement for the past 40 years.
mafia-like war that has been waged inside Osho’s movement for the past 40 years??? Where did this come from???
Now, I have never been to Osho’s premises or been a part of his movement, so I don’t know, and could have totally missed the obvious, but really? so this kind of statement is what??? serious? Rajneesh has been buried in this stuff.
Anyway, Sarlo’s list has a problem, Judge not, lest…
And his ratings were often off the wall.
update: found the new site: http://www3.telus.net/public/sarlo/Ratings.htm
I note that E. J. Gold gets two and a half stars for a rating, and is said to be the legacy successor to Gurdieff.
Sarlo doesnt’ know a sufi gangster when he sees one, and doesn’t know the difference between a guru and a stand up comedian.
So my trust in these ratings plumments, all at once.
The Last Days of Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh’s Commune in America
Apr 8, 2010 Chris Deziel
The Commune Was the Start of a New Day – Anna Cervova
Was the deportation of Rajneesh from the U.S. in 1985 an exposition of religious intolerance or a victory against quasi-religious excesses?
It is remarkable that this confusing set of events is still being debated.
The issue here is that as I reflect on the past generation’s New Age movements we can see how the real movements were all destroyed, for whatever reason, and that we have a lot of fakes creating substitutes.
We have set up a few too many posts here passing without commentary some of the critiques of Rajneesh, but the disinformation here is endless.
I have a bad feeling that a lot of it is crap.
We have taken the stance, after our study of the significance history of Danielou that Rajneesh was doing all this primordial Shaivaism stuff a generation ago.
We might therefore put our critiques on hold, and start over, as a Rajneesh follower attempted to warn us. Note that I still use ‘Rajneesh’. Osho was after my time! Rajneesh was someone I experienced in the seventies, at which point the first flood of his classic books published in Poona were coming out. I was a very reserved observer throughout, and in some ways regret staying aloof, but I did read a lot of his great classic texts, with their color photographs. You could see dozens of Rajneesh sannyasins walking in the East Village, and the movement was a real explosion of people, people you don’t associate with religious groups or New Age ashrams.
My point here ultimately is my discovery that you have a ‘stargate’ in this zone, something that is larger than Rajneesh/Osho. The New Age crap that is now being foisted on what’s left of the New Age movement (consider Andrew Cohen and Ken Wilbur) is itself now fading. It might help to restudy the Rajneesh phenomenon. To draw your own conclusions. I mean merely that we have been in the ‘guru attack’ mode in the net style of many sites, but there is another dimension here.
My general point is to continue my discussion of the Danielou history with a pointed indicator toward Rajneesh, who knew deeply and understood what Danielou stumbled on, still unable to free himself from Hinduism.
The Rajneesh zone in India is already far larger than any guru, and it would be nice to be able to study it.
Read the rest of this entry »
Uncloaking the CIA [Hardcover]
Yale University, 1975 Conference on the CIA and World Peace (Author), Howard Frazier (Author, Editor)
Looking through a rare book on the CIA that mentions the JFK connection (more books on the subject say nothing here), and the real harm done to many orgs (cf. bit on AFL/CIA), leaving one to wonder which New Age movements have been harmed, if any.
Gurdjieff, or course, is suspected of Intelligence connections, an important clue to the depraved nihilist character of his pack of lies.
The Quest for the Origins of Vedic Culture: The Indo-Aryan Migration Debate [Paperback]
Edwin Bryant (Author)
Useful and iinteresting text on the issues, but a bit opaque as the author tries to fend off both sides in a neutral pose.
Let us remember during periods of hard times, that Gurdjieff’s long term aims were the destruction of labor power, the establishment of elite domination, and finally the reestablisment of slavery.
It is important to be vigilant at the point where democracy is suffering, to remember that the ultra-rightist doctrine of Gurdjieff lurks in disguise in his ‘teaching’.
Such con men have no authority beyond their power to mesmerize, and their followers even less, as total nullities exploited by this dark teaching.
These people hope to undermine democratic life. Time to stop this Gurdjieff fan club nonsense
We have discussed this question in another form here: the idea of the ‘demiurge’ in Bennett’s The Dramatic Universe.
Bennett actually tries to get specific on some points: e.g. the claim that ‘bodies of ligtht’ are made of ‘conscious energy’, after the fashion of his outlandish, tho interesing, formulation of transcorporal beings.
MBFM on the German ‘whodunit’.
To get part of the puzzle, one must look at the horrible food shortages and starvation that affected Wilhelmine Germany during World War I and that also hit Vienna and possibly other parts of Austria. Read the rest of this entry »